‘He will never say: Do this, do that’

What was it like growing up with Mr Lee?

Dr Lee Suan Yew: I could only remember the time during the war, when I was about nine, he was about 19. World War II: That was a time when the family was very close together, during the war years. He had just started at Raffles College and he was very upset that the war interrupted his studies there. For me, I was just going to Primary Two and my studies were interrupted. My parents didn’t want me to attend any school, the Japanese-type school, because my parents were afraid that they were training us to become young soldiers. So I had no real education after that.

So while we were at home, he took time to play chess with me. He had plenty of time so he taught me the moves and all that, and I enjoyed playing chess with him. There were times when we would go out for meals together, but he was a quieter person.

The rest of us siblings, we were more active, shall we say. He was more of a bookworm, the studious person, the scholar, and we would leave him alone if he was studying and all that or reading. We would continue with our own studies but we had lot of games and activities. He would have less of that.

What kind of a big brother was he? There was a big, 10-year gap between the two of you.

Dr Lee: He was really a wonderful brother because as an older brother, he was a really responsible person, very wise and always willing to give advice to us. At any time we say we would like to meet him, he will say, sure come over and we’ll chat with him and he will give his advice. He will never say: Do this, do that — very seldom. He’ll just give you the idea and you decide. That’s his advice, and he says, well, think about it.

What was the most significant advice or counsel he gave to you?

Dr Lee: The most significant advice he gave me was about my studies. He somehow felt I wasn’t pushing myself hard enough. I did fairly well in school but not the way he did. And so when he asked me, what would you like to do when you finish school, I said I’d like to take up medicine. He said, what about law? Because law is shorter and it’ll cost less to the family. Then he advised me that if I want to do medicine, at that time, why not go to England and do medicine? He said if you want to go to England to do medicine, you’ve got to study very hard because it’s very competitive. It’s not very competitive in Singapore, but it’s very competitive in the UK. At the rate I was going, he said you had better buck up and study hard. That’s all he had to tell me and it just clicked and I said yah, maybe I have not been pushing myself. I should really give more effort, and it paid dividends. Because, when I went to London to prepare for my pre-university, I kept thinking about what he said. My parents, surprisingly, were not as astute as he was. My parents somehow knew I would make it, but big brother was more careful and he said I think you better study very hard and that paid dividends because when I went for pre-university preparation I really put a lot of effort so that was good.

What about the relationship in the family, among the siblings. Was it a very close-knit family?

Dr Lee: Yes, close-knit family. But again, we would always give him space. He’s a quieter person. We’re a bit more boisterous. But he will participate in certain family activities.

Was there any recollection of Mr Lee getting up to some mischief when he was younger?

Dr Lee: Well, no, not quite mischief. Oh yes! I remember he was ragged, when he first entered Raffles College. Those days there were ragging and he was very upset. He wore the white shirt and trousers, almost like the PAP uniform, and when he came back, it was very dirty because he was ragged and he was really furious. He didn’t like it at all (laughs). And my parents just pacified him.

What about special memories or anecdotes to share?

Dr Lee: Yes, one incident we discovered. We knew that he’s a very particular person. But one day, my second brother, Dennis, wore his shoes without his permission and enjoyed wearing it, but when he returned it, he didn’t clean it or something and big brother was very furious with him and we all heard about it. There was no end to that story. From that day on, all of us knew that we must not touch his things unless we got permission to use it. But he’s not selfish. You can use his things, but he feels that you must ask his permission and then return it as you found it.

We’ve heard how exacting and tough he is in terms of his work, but would you say he has a soft side?

Dr Lee: Yes, definitely yes. We noticed that any member of the family or friends, if they are ill, he will pay a visit if he has enough time. Even during his very busy period, he’ll make the effort. One thing about him, he wants to make sure the person who is ill is given courage to get better. He’ll even talk to the doctors and make sure the person recovers well. When I was ill, he visited me in hospital, when I was in Tan Tock Seng, he popped in. He was so busy, yet he dropped in, he talked to the doctors to make sure that everything was all right and I recovered. He was so happy.

How about the relationship he had with his immediate family? Would you say that’s one area that was extremely important to him?

Dr Lee: He always feels he did not have enough time with the family when he became a politician. So he made a special effort to make sure there was always a dinner together and that would be New Year’s Eve dinner. We’ll always make sure we get together for birthdays, if he’s got time he will make sure we get together for birthday dinners. He has a very soft spot for my sister. We only have one sister and somehow he’ll always be very protective of her and make sure she’s well cared for and he’ll give his two cents and all.

Do you think there was any particular incident in his childhood that shaped the kind of policy decisions he made as a politician?

Dr Lee: Yes. I think when he was in England, when he was reading law. He noticed that politics was very important, that it shapes the country’s future education, economy and so on. So I think he was influenced by the Labour Party. He might have been influenced by the socialist Labour party but he’s not an extremist.

He was, I would say, very moderate, but I think in his mind he was thinking of Singapore, that one day he would come back and help solve our economy and the poor people and that part showed up later on — we noticed that he was interested in helping uplift the poor people. And education as well, because all along he said education would be the one thing to uplift the poor people and level up their status.

What do you think was his biggest regret?

Dr Lee: I think that’s quite obvious. His regret was that Singapore was separated from Malaysia. I think that’s his biggest regret. His dream was to see the bigger picture of Singapore like New York of the United States and KL, the Washington DC. And he was very sad that we had to part company. He really wanted to have a real Malaysian Malaysia. And that, I have a feeling, that one is the one he had a lot of regrets about.

What about arts and culture? You are very interested in it yourself, but how was he with the arts?

Dr Lee: He prefers more concrete things rather than the arts. But his wife, Geok Choo, loved classical music. And he, being very much in love with his wife, would comply and follow her to the Esplanade and listen to some concerts. But one thing good is that because of this, his children, such as Hsien Loong, love classical music. So that has a nice spin-off there. I think he was quite careful with the state putting money into the arts until other ministers came in and said to him, that it was very important . I think a fine example is (former Minister for Information and the Arts) George Yeo. He influenced how we should put our money into Esplanade and look at the Esplanade today: It’s a world-class theatre and we’re bringing in world-class artistes.

How would you describe Mr Lee’s relationship with his wife and children?

Dr Lee: It’s quite extraordinary. His love for her was truly until death did them part. It’s so obvious, even with us, within our family, that we have them for dinner together, we must seat them together. We cannot separate them and she will somehow keep an eye on his food. He’s quite careful with his diet but she is even more careful with his diet to make sure that he is eating the right kind of food and so on.

His love for her, I think we all know, is very deep and he, the story went, when she was semi-comatose, at 10 o’clock when even we had dinner together, he’d say, I’m sorry, I have to leave you now, and go back home and read her her favourite story books; because she was brain locked, she could hear but she couldn’t utter. So she could listen to his voice, she would recognise his voice and it’s quite amazing. A man who’s so busy will make sure that at 10 o’clock he’ll go back and read her her favourite books, and we’re all very touched by that.

His children — he’s not a physical person. He’s not a man who’ll hug you and so on, but his love for the children was also tremendous. He loves them, but he wants to make sure they’re well educated. That’s why each of them became a President’s Scholar. So genetically, they were well-endowed, and at the same time they studied very hard and the parents would oversee their education.

But the love for the children is very, how shall we say, not ostentatious. It’s very Eastern, not Western, in style. When Hsien Loong was ill, the tremendous anxiety ... in the parents was very obvious, but thank goodness he overcame his illness and that is another example.